ZNAK SAGITE — više od fantastike — edicija, časopis, knjižara...

ah, pa konji vrani su, koliko cujem, exploitation uzitak prve vrste.  

ali, mislim da ce evropski gledaoci biti znacajno osteceni ako ovo bude islo kao dva filma.

Pa nije valjda ovo prvi Tarantinov film koji sadrži grudi?  

film je nabacio 5 milionceta u prvom danu.  
vrlo slabo, u kontekstu onog sta su prognozirali neki ozbiljni prognozicari.
 film deluje da ce ponoviti scenario snakes on plane. veliki internet hype, malo zainteresovanosti od strane generalne publike.

mada para je ustvari ok, ako se ima u vidu tri i kusur sata za istripovani, prepunkrvi film.

...weekend total-11.591.000 USD ,shto nije loshe ako se u obzir uzmu kalendar, visoko-konceptualna priroda projekta, ne bash praktichno trajanje( shto, samo po seb, povlachi i manji broj projekcija po ekranu)...

...ali je lose ako se  uzme u obzir budzet od 53 miliona.

grindhouse je promasaj u opening weekendu.
bilo je procena da ce bit prvi na top listi, al su ga blades for glory i are we done yet usili momacki...

Quote from: "Dr Kunac"I knew it! Zika i Mamba su vec omrsili brke...  Nije da vam ne zavidim, ali mi ovde u Srbijici bar mozemo premijerno da overimo Konje vrane...

a mi ne možemo ni to  

It was another story for "Grindhouse," which occupied the fourth spot with an estimated $11.6 million. The film, with a reported budget of $53 million, played in 2,624 locations but came nowhere near other recent films from Tarantino and Rodriguez. Two years ago, Rodriguez's "Sin City" bowed to $29.1 million in 3,230 theaters, while Tarantino's "Kill Bill-Vol. 1" in 2003 and "Kill Bill-Vol 2" in 2004 launched to $22.1 million and $25.1 million respectively.

The film, which combines a zombie flick from Rodriguez with a demolition derby by Tarantino, picked up enthusiastic reviews from connoisseurs of down-and-dirty genre filmmaking, but didn't appear to reach beyond the two directors' hardcore fan base. "It's disappointing," Harvey Weinstein, co-head of the Weinstein Co., said. "It performed brilliantly in the East and the West, but not so good in the South. Market research that we did showed there was a resistance to the running time, but this is exactly what the boys wanted to do, reinvent the cinematic experience. It got such great reviews and such great scores, that it's baffling, and we're just going to have to educate the audience."

Weinstein added that because the two movies-within-a-movie -- Rodriguez's "Planet Terror" and Tarantino's "Death Proof"-- will play as separate films internationally, on cable and on DVD, the project's economic model would be vindicated since essentially the company would be fielding two $25 million movies by the two directors.

Ma jeste, sigurno!

A bi li Ziko  sherovao sors?

danasnji Hollywood Reporter

For many years director Quentin Tarantino would bring up the idea of a film focussing on the two Vega brothers - Michael Madsen in "Reservoir Dogs" and John Travolta in "Pulp Fiction." The talk never eventuated though and slowly died away. Now, QT tells Slashfilm what might have been:

"I even had a title for it. It was called Double V Vega. It actually would have taken place during the time Vincent was in Amsterdam, when he was running one of Marcellus' clubs in Amsterdam. And Vic goes to visit him," revealed Tarantino.

He adds "But we're a little older now, and since they both died - it would have to be a prequel. I actually came up with a way I could have done it, even being older and dead where they all had older brothers and both of their brothers got together because the two guys died. And they wanted revenge or something like that. But now, they [the actors] are too old for that... I got to say, it's kind of unlikely now."

Hvala Ziko

Neuspeh Grindhousea potvrdjuje da je trend uspeha horora na bioskopskom trzistu u Americi gotov.
Prosle godine, u ovom periodu, svaki horor koji se pojavio, od pocetka godine zaradio je iznad 40 miliona, ili ako je bio low profile, 20 miliona (osim Slithera).
Od Omena i 6.6.2006., osim SAW3, nijedan horor nije premasio 40 mil.


GH i Reaping su dva skupa high profile filma, ciji neuspeh ce imati vece posledice od neuspeha npr. Primevela ili Hitchera, pocetkom godine.

Quote from: "lenny"Neuspeh Grindhousea potvrdjuje da je trend uspeha horora na bioskopskom trzistu u Americi gotov.

to su VRLO preuranjeni zaključci.

pre svega, nedovoljno jak PRVI VIKEND, u slučaju jednog ovakvog filma, nije nesumnjivi znak propasti njegovih finansija: ni PULP FICTION nije imao neko spektakularno otvaranje prvog vikenda, pa gledaj gde je dospeo. word of mouth kod ovog filma biće vrlo važan.
lepo je reko harvi: ovo je film koji treba da EDUKUJE svoju publiku. on se ne dodvorava postojećem trendu, već pokušava da stvori novi.
uostalom, svoje pare će povratiti u evropi i japanu + na dvdu, tako da propast nije sigurno.

kao drugo, i još važnije: čak i ako prihvatim da je grindhouse pukao, propao, prs'o itd. – extrapolacija njegovog rezultata na čitav žanr je, blago rečeno, promašena.
grindhouse ni po čemu nije tipičan horor film da bi se preko njega odlučivalo bilo šta o sudbini horora.
on nije tipičan FILM, pre svega (na stranu žanr): to je jedno iskustvo, experiment, od koga niko normalan nije ni smeo da očekuje blokbaster.

ako prihvatimo tužnu činjenicu da su ciljna grupa horora tinejdžeri i young adults, dakle, oni 14-28 godina, jasno je da je gro te publike rođen POSLE zalaska tog grindhouse iskustva. oni tek treba da otkriju ove filmove i ovo iskustvo.

horor je možda, trenutno, u blago-silaznoj putanji glede zarade na usa box ofisu, ali daleko od toga da je to dovoljan razlog za doom & gloom.

ako pogledaš sadašnji box ofis, na njemu ćeš naći čak 4 naslova.
od toga 2 među prvih 10. i treći odmah na 11. mestu. i četvrti – na 14. mestu.
drugim rečima, u top 15 filmova imaš čak 4 horora.
SVAKI ČETVRTI FILM U TOP 15 JE HOROR, I TEBI JE TO ZNAK OPALOG INTERESA ZA TAJ ŽANR???!!!
ajd pogledaj još jednom listu, ovde:
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/weekend/chart/

pri tom, povrh svega, jedan INOSTRANI, na španskom, zaradio blizu tvoje fixne granice od 40 miliona (trenutno je na $37,164,000).
ej, titlovani film! španski! usred amerike! bio čak i nominovan za neke važne oskare! par njih i dobio!

a ako pogledaš najave horor koji imaju premijere u narednim mesecima, i najave onih koji tek počinju da se snimaju, ako pogledaš koja su sve imena režiseri, koji su sve glumci uključeni, koji bidžeti itd. videćeš - da trend nikako nije gotov.

Prvo, potpuno se slazem da GH nije tipican horor film, odnosno da ga nije olako povezati sa popularnim hororima poslednjih par godina. Medjutim, ono sto ga povezuje sa jednim delom tog trenda je njegova okrenutost sedamdesetim. Dobar deo uspesnih(po zaradi) horora su remakeovi horora iz sedamdesetih, Hills, Dawn of Dead, Omen i sl. Tako da on nije potpuno apartan slucaj.  
 

Drugo to je Horor. Zna se kakve noge(dalje kotiranje na listama) horor moze da ima. A zna se i kako prolaze filmovi QT i Rodrigueza. Tvoje pominjanje PF nije na mestu, jer tada, pre oko trinaest godina, situacija je bilo prilicno drugacija. Pri tom, QT tada nije bio ime koje je danas. Sa ovavkvim startom, film nema apsolutne sanse da stigne, po meni ni 35, a kamoli 50 mil.  Da se razumemo, ja bih najvise voleo da gresim, i da njih dvojca naprave nekakvu senzaciju i promene zakone trzista.
 Jos nesto, danas u Hollywoodu prvi vikend je najvazniji. Uspeh filma se meri, u 70% slucajeva, po njegovoj zaradi u prvom vikendu. Primer: reditelj Stomp the Yarda, sa pocetak godine, tokom iste nedelje posto je film napravio iznenadjenje na blagajnama, dobio je gomilu ponuda, izmedju ostalog i da ekranizuje Millerov Ronin.  Ove godine izgleda da postaje pravilo da 4 ili vise filmova izlazi svakog vikenda.  Tu je pitanje percepcije uspeha! Druga stvar je pravi finansijski uspeh filma koji mi mozemo samo da nagadjamo.  Ali racunaj da u proseku, zarada u bioskopu hollywoodskog filma predstavlja oko 20% njegovog ukupnog profita, no to je druga prica.


Trece preuranjeni zakljuci su mogli tako da se nazovu posle katastrofalnih rezultata TCM: Pocetka i Grudga 2 u oktobru. Danas je jasno horori ne zaradjuju vise te pare. Pogledaj kako su se kotirali horori 2005. i 2006. do aprila. Cak, ako hoces, pogledaj kako su se kotirali 2004. i 2005. naspram 2006.
 Ove godine skoro svi horori su podbacili, manje vise.  Pri tom imao si silna pomeranja, Buenavista baca Primeval dva meseca pre najavljenog reklamiranog datuma, Invisible, high profile horor, se pomera, Rogue odlazu i sl.  
Panov Lavirint nema apsolutno nikakve veze sa hororom. Bar sto se tice plasiranja na trziste. On je bio predstavljen kao critically acclaimed fantasy film.

 Uspeh horora, ovih dve,tri godine unazad, je pocivao na vrlo jednostavnoj racunici. Jeftini su, do 20 mil, i povratak ulozenog novca je siguran, a rizik minimalan, jos mozda i iznenadi.
(Zato Dark Castle nikad nije postigao uspeh sa hororima)


Moja poenta je da ovog vikenda, neuspeh GH i Reapinga, u koji ,iako je odlagan cesto, je ulozena fina para za kampanju, potvrdjuju da stvari odavno vise nisu blistave. Sta imamo Vacancy, Invisible i Hostel 2. Ako bar jedan ne ostvari bar dobar prihod, odnos industrije prema zanru ce se ozbiljno promeniti.  Mada ce horor sigurno idalje ostati poligon za uvodjenje stranaca i podmladka u posao

pa, ne znam, ja ovo vidim kao normalnu fluktuaciju, ups & downs of film business; uostalom, sa LOŠIM hororima kakve izbacuju u zadnje vreme, NE ZASLUŽUJU čak ni uspeh koji imaju sada (tj. 4 horora u top 15, od kojih su svi već u plusu, sem GH koji je tek krenuo).

čak i filmovi koji su imali užasne kritike (PREMONITION, HILLS 2), i to ne samo kod ozbiljnih kritičara, nego i kod fanova i na žanrovskim sajtovima, finansijski su vrlo dobro prošli; tako će biti i sa REAPING: možda nije legend in the making, ali povratiće kapital i zaraditi još koje milionče preko već u bioskopima, a onda DVD itd...

tačno je da sadašnji horori prolaze slabije od nekih koji su bili uspešniji prethodnih godina, zato jer su ovi raniji bili BOLJI; i ja nešto slabiju zaradu DANAS u odnosu na NEKOĆ vidim u slabijim hororima DANAS, a ne u slabljenju trenda, kao što si ti kazao gore.
TCM: Početak, Grudge 2. Wicker Man, Pulse, itd su bili LOŠI filmovi koji su pukli zato što su LOŠI a ne zato što su horori i što horore više niko neće da gleda.

interes za dobre horore postoji, a kao što svedoče HILLS 2, Premonition itd, ima ga (još uvek) čak i za loše.
naravno, ako se producenti suviše ulenje i počnu da isporučuju isključivo smeće, i publika će da postane probirljivija; ali ne mislim da horor više nije 'in' (mada, slažem se i ponavljam, nije ni na onom vrhu na kojem je bio pre par godina, što bi bilo možda i previše očekivati). uostalom, horor već punih 10 godina, još od VRISKA, nije imao bitniji pad u popularnosti i prisustvu na box ofisu, u medijima, među zvučnim rediteljskim i glumačkim imenima, stalno je bilo high-profile projekata zajedno sa low-budget iznenađenjima, što je NEZABELEŽEN slučaj sa hororom u čitavoj njegovoj istoriji, s izuzetkom neprekinutog 'cuga' 1973-1982 (circa od EXORCISTA do EVIL DEADA i THE THINGA).

U periodu do 2002., recimo oo 1999., broj horora koji je premasivao zaradu od 40 mil, kretao se od jednog do dva. Tek od 2003. vise od 4 ili 5 horora premasuje tu cifru, ali olako dosezu i do 70-80 mil, ili preko 100 u slucaju grudga ili ringa.  Isto tako medju pedeset najgledanijih filmova godishnje procentualno ucesce horora raste. To, sa zadrskom, mozemo uzeti kao parametar porasta njihovog ucesca u godishnjoj produkciji holivuda.

U tom kontekstu, 2007., predstavlja pad u njihovoj uspesnosti.
Premonition je natprirodni triler sa Sandrom Cmulok, nema apsolutno nikakve veze sa hororom, a nije ni ciljao publiku, gore ustanovljenu, horora, niti su oni ti koji obezbedjuju njegovu zaradu.
Reaping sigurno kosta oko 40 mil, toliko inace kostaju Dark Castle horori. Pitanje je da li ce zaraditi i pola te sume.

E sad, ja sam oduvek smatrao da vredonosni  sudovi o filmovima nemaju preteranu relevantnost kada je u pitanju uspeh filmova na blagajnama (ne bih da ulazim u tu raspravu). Samtram da je sasvim  dovoljno prepoznati kretanja odredjenih zanrova i ciklusa u odredjenom vremenskom periodu.  Pronaci razlog i posledice toga, nije ni malo lak i jednostavan posao. Za to treba vremena, sto za samo istrazivanje, sto vremenska distanca koja ce to bolje osvetliti.

Quote from: "lenny"U periodu do 2002., recimo oo 1999., broj horora koji je premasivao zaradu od 40 mil, kretao se od jednog do dva. Tek od 2003. vise od 4 ili 5 horora premasuje tu cifru, ali olako dosezu i do 70-80 mil, ili preko 100 u slucaju grudga ili ringa.  

bojim se da ipak pričaš napamet.
pre 2002. si imao više horor multimilionera.
sva 3 VRISKA su imala zaradu preko 100 miliona u periodu 1997-2002.
1999. si, pored njih, imao još i fenomenalne uspehe ŠESTOG ČULA i BLAIR WITCHA.
mislim da je DEEP BLUE SEA takođe prebacio 40 mil $.
itd.

ne priznajem te izmišljene 'žanrove' kao što su 'critically acclaimed fantasy film' ili 'natprirodni triler sa Sandrom Cmulok'.
ne priznaje ih nijedna enciklopedija filma, niti ozbiljnija teorijska studija o filmu i žanrovima, pa ih ne priznajem ni ja.
dok mi neko ne objasni po čemu se ti filmovi (PAN, odnosno REAPING) razlikuju od horora, oni su za mene horori.
dovoljno je videti postere ili plakate da to bude jasno.

na kraju, podsetiću te da je 2007. tek počela, a ti već sudiš o 'padu' koji ona donosi...

Vrisak 3 je izasao 2000. A 1999. sam uzeo, okvirno kao godinu kada je prestao primat Kevin Williamsonovih slashera.

U pravu si 99. ih je bilo 5 iznad 40 miliona, sest ako racunas Sleepy Hollow.  Ali Haunting, Deep Blue Sea, ne mogu se svrstati u ovaj trend horora o kome mi pricamo,  jer  njihovi budzeti su tri odnosno cetiri puta veci od proseka, i imaju release pattern summer tentpolea.
Ali 98. bio je samo jedan Halloween H20, a 97. dva, Znam sta ste radili  Scream 2.
Za ostale podatke sam prilicno blizu, proveri sam na boxofficemojo.

Za Pana i Premonition (ne za Reaping), ja govorim o njihovoj distribuciji. Tacnije o nacinu na koji studijo promovise odredjeni film i o tome kako ga publika prihvata. Ta korelacija industrija-publika je kljucna za svako tumacenje zanrova, jer zanr nije toliko stvar teorije koliko je stvar koja ima upotrebnu vrednost, olaksava i omogucava, uostalom, percepciju filma.
 A svaki zanr, tacnije podzanr, danas, za sobom povlaci drugaciju publiku, stoga i drugaciji marketing, drugaciju distribuciju i drugaciji odnos prema njemu.

Premonition, covece Ghoule, nije nikakav horor, i nigde se  kao takav ne navodi (imdb, boxofficemojo), i ja ga gledao, veruj. Pan ne pripada ovom trendu horora o kome mi pricamo, ako ni zbog cega, ono zato shto nije americki film, te ne deli iste produkcione okolnosti koje su krucijalne za pomenti ciklus!
Ziv mi bio!

pazi, žanr jeste, pored ostalog, i marketinška kategorija, i ja posmatram i u tom svetlu.
ali ona za mene nije primarna.
za žanrovsku pripadnost jednog filma meni je ključno: koja mu je estetička namera, i na koji način, kojim postupcima i obradom (kakvom?) kojih motiva je ostvarena.
to je za mene fundament, a ne šta je određeni departman određenog studija procenio da će da se nosi ovog leta, i pod kojom etiketom će svoj horor ovog leta/jeseni da prodaju.
za mene su čak i izjave samih autora u velikoj meri irelevantne, ili barem sekundarne, kad se govori o pitanjima koja su za mene pre svega FORMALNA.

recimo, gledam juče spec. ed. OMENA, i r. doner tu kaže nešto kao: 'ovaj moj film nije horor, da su me terali da pravim horor, ja bih to odbio, mene horor ne zanima: ja sam napravio jedan mistični religijski triler.'
a u tom istom dokumentarcu i montažer i kompozitor govore o svojim doprinosima HORORU, tj stvaranju napetosti i izazivanju STRAVE.
znači, da li ja sada kao neko ko proučava žanr treba više da verujem donerovim rečima, ili tome šta je pisalo na plakatu filma tamo neke 1976. kada su ga pustili u bioskope kao high-profile gregory fuckin' peck starring 'thriller', ili ću da uzmem i analiziram odnos forme i sadržine tog filma, iz koje je sasvim jasno da se radi o horor filmu, i da uopšte nije potrebno izmišljanje novih (pod)žanrova i kategorija.

u tom smislu, štagod marketing departman kazao o tome, NARAVNO da su meni i PAN i SLEEPY HOLLOW i DEEP BLUE SEA – horor filmovi.
nisu čisti (ako je išta, igde, ikada), imaju elemente drugih žanrova, ali dominantan je horor.
umesto prolazne i lokalne napetosti jedne komedije (da li će stanlio i olio pasti sa one visoke skele 30 spratova niže?) ili trilera (da li će born otkriti svoj identitet? da li će popaj dojl da sustigne zlikovca koji mu beži metroom? da li je sused stvarno ubio ženu?...) svi gorenavedeni filmovi svoju napetost baziraju na podrivanju ontološke sigurnosti čoveka i njegovog mesta u poretku stvari, ukazuju na mogućnost drugih stvorenja, drugih moći, drugih sistema u kojima bi čovek KAO VRSTA mogao imati znatno niže mesto u lancu ishrane... i time izazivaju STRAVU koja nije ista kao ona triler-napetost, suštinski je drugačija.

i u tom svetlu me baš živo zabole za to što nečiji markting neće da zalepi reč 'horor' na svoj produkt zato što u njemu igraju majkl daglas i katarina zeta džons, ili već kojagod 'zvezda', nego ga prekrštavaju u 'psihološki triler', 'mistični triler', 'mračna fatazija', 'bajka za odrasle' i sl. floskule koje znače sve i ništa.

marketing može da na publiku utiče u smislu toga koji će film ODABRATI da (ne) gleda, ali ne može da utiče na njihov DOŽIVLJAJ tog filma, niti na njegov krajnji žanrovski status.

možeš ti do sudnjega dana ALIENA reklamirati kao SF: ako ljudi sve vreme sede na ivici stolice, skaču od šokova, tresu se od jeze, osećaju stravu pri susretu sa jednim sasvim drugim planom stvarnosti u kome ni njihova ljudskost ni sva fensi tehnologija neznamkoje budućnosti ne mogu da ih odbrane od jednog lavkraftoidno-neuništivog monstruma, onda je to, for my money, horor pre svega, uprkos svim 'sf' džidža-midžama koje su tu da 'prikriju' gotsku ikonografiju stilizovanu tako da asocira i na budućnost a ne samo na srednji vek, iako je UČINAK isti kao i u klasičnom hororu.

itd.

meni se cini da se vi igrate gluvih telefona.
ghoul nastupa kao "formalista" i "proucavalac zanra", sto je u osnovi akademska kategorija, dok leni pise iz ugla produkcije, marketinga i distribucije.
leni kaze da ne posmatra zanr kao teorijsku i formalnu konstrukciju, vec ga zanima prakticna upotreba, a ghoul kaze zabole me za praktichnu upotrebu, ako se zanr ne posmatra iz ugla forme.
i zato mozete ovako terati do ujutru, nece se posoliti, a obojica ste u pravu, svaki u svom svetu.

fala, žiko, što si reko očiglednost: jasno je da lenny i ja ne pričamo sasvim istim jezikom, ali važno je da PRIČAMO...

kad on kaže: žanr je u krizi, ja to mogu da prihvatim samo kao 'jedna uska predstava žanra i njegovog marketinga je trenutno u krizi'...

jeste ociglednost, a ipak je odnos izmedju "uske predstave zanra" i teorijskih modela zasnovanih na formi ono sto cini zanr. znam da si ti rekao kako ti marketing (ali i distribucija i odnos studija prema zanru, kao i reagovanje publike) nije primarni modus misljenja u proucavanju zanra, ali mi se cini da je insistiranje na pomenutim estetickim namerama suvise strogo, dok je teza o "podrivanju ontoloske sigurnosti coveka" presiroka.
prvo dodje ekonomska baza, i tu leni ima pravo, iako se slazem da je "kriza zanra" malo ishitrena (hipo)teza.
ipak, ziveo ti sa insistiranjem na FORMI i ESTETICI, jer u ovom nasilju marketinga i "reakcije publike" - teorijska istina o zanrovskim kodovima moze casom pasti u zaborav.

Cekajte molim vas!
Vi sad odoste u cistu teoriju! Ghoul mi se ne raspravljamo oko toga sta je horor, sta je zanr, i zasto smo ovde na ovom svetu! Fino je to sto ti ovde kazes, ali nije poenta u tome.
Ja pricam o odredjenom ciklusu horora, u tacno odredjeno vreme, i njegovom status, odnosno padu, istina hipoteza, u okviru mejnstrim holivudske produkcije.
 Ili da pojednostavim, pricamo o tome da horor polako izlazi iz mode, odnosno da zaradjuje manje para nego lane!  Cak nismo stigli ni dotle kakve ce to posledice imati kako na holivudski tako ni na svakavi ostali horor!
 No, bitno je da pricamo!

teorijska istina o zanrovski kodovima jeste stvar koja je nastala na osnovu prethodnih filmova!  Zanr nije apstraktna, vec  opipljiva stvar koja je u stalnom fluxu, u pokusaju da objasni i sazme stare  ali i nove filmove.  
no za to postoji ozbiljna literatura i bolovi u glavi koji uz to idu!  

mislim da je sve nas ovde bolela glava od te literature, tak da sad imamo skor od dve ociglednosti u raspravi.  

Tarantino u zeljid a edukuje publiku, prikazuje griondhouse filmove iz svoje licne 35mm kolekcije. Grindhouse fest, ovde

http://www.newbevcinema.com/

Quote from: "lenny"Cekajte molim vas!
Vi sad odoste u cistu teoriju! Ghoul mi se ne raspravljamo oko toga sta je horor, sta je zanr, i zasto smo ovde na ovom svetu! Fino je to sto ti ovde kazes, ali nije poenta u tome.

ne znam koliko je ovde očigledno to da sam u priču o tome šta je horor, šta žanr, a šta smisao bitka, ušao samo zato što je leni počeo da mi pokrštava pastvu i da kazuje 'ovaj horor nije horor no je psiho-triler, ovaj horor nije horor no je fantazija', itd.

uspona i padova popularnosti bilo je i u protekloj deceniji, od VRISKA naovamo: nije svaka godine blagdan bio baš blag, ali je posle svakog od tih 'padova popularnosti' dolazio neki RING ili neki SAW, ili GRUDGE, da izvadi stvar i povrati veru publike u bioskopski horor.

znači, ja nisam ubeđen, i ponavljam, prerano je tvrditi da evidentno manja (ali ne DRASTIČNO manja) zarada LOŠIH horora u prvom kvartalu o.g. znači definitivan pad popularnosti horora, i da se stvar neće preobratiti nekim novim surprise DOBRIM hitom već letos ili jesenas.

EXCLUSIVE (keep refreshing for latest): Harvey Weinstein told me this morning that he's "incredibly disappointed" with the half-than-expected $12 mil box office for Grindhouse released on Easter Weekend (a controversial move itself). So much so, that he's considering abandoning the double feature as a single feature concept and re-releasing the Quentin Tarantino/Robert Rodriguez movie around the U.S. "in a couple of weeks" as two separate feature-length movies with additional footage put in. That's what Harvey says The Weinstein Co. is already intending to do with the film's release in Europe: split it into two separate pics, Tarantino's Death Proof and  Rodriguez's Planet Terror. "Quentin's movie goes out first in competition at Cannes. He'll do an extensive 4 to 5 month tour. And the trailer will be all Quentin's," Weinstein told me about his European plans. "Then we'll release Robert's a couple of months later. By splitting it up, we're going to do a hell of a lot better internationally than we did here." Weinstein noted that, even in Grindhouse's video deal as well as its TV deal with Starz Entertainment Group, it's been sold as two separate movies. "Our deal with Encore is that they can play it any way they want." So this is why The Weinstein Co. is now deciding to suck it up and do in this country what it probably should have done all along. "First of all, I'm incredibly disappointed. We tried to do something new and obviously we didn't do it that well," Harvey told me today. "It's just a question of how is it going to hang in there. But we could split the movies in a couple of weeks. Make Tarantino's a full-length film, and Rodriguez's too. We'll be adding those 'two missing reels' that's talked about in the movie." (At one point in Grindhouse, a sex scene is interrupted because of "two missing reels" -- one of the many conceits and indulgences.)

Weinstein pointed to several reasons why Grindhouse did so poorly in theaters over Easter weekend. "Our research showed the length kept people away. It was the single biggest deterrent. It was 3 hours and 12 minutes long. We originally intended to get it all in in 2 hours, 30 minutes. That would have been a better time. But the movies ran longer, the [fake] trailers ran longer, everything ran longer," Harvey told me. Weinstein also criticized his own marketing plan. "We didn't educate the South or Midwest. In the West and the East, the movie played well. It played well in strong urban settings. But we missed the boat on the Midwest and the South." But he denies others' thinking that the Grindhouse subject matter was too foreign for mainstream audiences in mainstream theaters. He's wrong, of course. (In many theaters, before the pic began, either a leaflet was handed out or an usher came out to tell audiences that Grindhouse was designed to look old and scratched and to have "missing reels", and that the intermission, including the fake trailers, was also part of the movie. Obviously the managements had received some complaints at earlier shows.) Yet The Weinstein Co. wouldn't give the film to actual Grindhouses, or even the Grindhouse Film Festival, to screen and create buzz. That may be one reason the advance tracking on the film prior to Friday was only so-so. The hype seems to have been all Internet-generated, which is why New Line's Snakes On A Plane flopped.

Weinstein admitted to spending at least $30 million on U.S. promotion and advertising for  Grindhouse, which, added to what I'd already heard was a $67+ mil budget and not the low-50s cost he has claimed, makes this at least a $100 mil movie. So the first weekend's take of just $12 mil is all the more disastrous. On the other hand, Harvey (and independent observers) says the film is heavily pre-sold overseas and expects it to do well there. That's not surprising, since many movies recently (Babel, Apocalypto) have run out of gas here only to pump up the total with international box office. But a re-release in the U.S. could prove almost prohibitively costly for The Weinstein Co.: new prints, new marketing, new everything. It may not be worth it, especially with Spider-Man 3 and the rest of this summer's tentpole onslaught just around the corner.

Weinstein admits that he thought the film would do much better than it did and sees the failure of Grindhouse's U.S. release as a rap on his reputation for movie savvy. He's in a bind here because, let's face it, he doesn't dare blame the directors. After all, he is closely tied to Tarantino and Rodriquez personally and professionally and, what's more, he and brother Bob made that relationship and Grindhouse a cornerstone of their fledgling company's financing. (No doubt that's why Harv, who has a long history of imposing his iron will on filmmakers, gave the two directors a pass when it came to Grindhouse's extreme length.)

But Harvey is adamant that the flop will not be a body blow to The Weinstein Co. "We're smart businessmen. Thank God, we protected ourselves economically. I've spent the last year diversifying the company. We're making profits everywhere but the movie business. But on DVD sales, we're doing well," he claims. The Weinstein Company's diversified investments include the home video company Genius Products, the private online community aSmallWorld, the cable TV hit show Project Runway, the independent cable channel Ovation, and, most recently, the Halston fashion brand. Harvey admitted to me that his attention may have been too diverted from the movie biz as a result. "This Cannes, I'm going to change all that. I'm back to being me. We wanted to diversify immediately. Now I have to go back to being Harvey."

http://www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com/what-went-so-wrong-with-grindhouse/

Ghoul ako je tebi nebitno kada je film izasao, i pod kakvim produkcionim okolnostima, ili trzisnim uslovima, i ako ces ti svakom da pristupas trazeci esteticku nameru i univerzalne vrednosti  nemamo se mi oko cega raspravljati, te nemojmo!  

Quote from: "lenny"Ghoul ako je tebi nebitno kada je film izasao, i pod kakvim produkcionim okolnostima, ili trzisnim uslovima,

PA-LIZ!!!

nisam nigde kazao NEBITNO, već samo SEKUNDARNO!

naravno da me zanima i to, i pratim i to, ali iz gore navedenih razloga, smatram MANJE BITNIM, sub spaeciae aeternitas, jer te dnevne floskule dođu i prođu, i utemeljene se u nekim daleko labavijim 'principima' od onih koje ja pratim.

Our Favorite GRINDHOUSE Films - And Hopefully Yours!

Hey folks - Harry here. There's been an awful lot of GRINDHOUSE headlines and titles over the past few weeks and month - but I've been getting an awful lot of letters from folks that are new to this multi-genre classic period of anything goes cinema. What I have here are some of AICN's Regulars - along with a pair of the Alamo Drafthouse's GRINDHOUSE programming, booking and print finding finest you'll ever find. And at the very end of this article - which will be posted - INCOMPLETE - as more and more from the AICN crew send their in... then at the very end, I'll include mine. I'm also going to ask you talkbackers to try to take part.

If you're old enough to remember the time period - share your Grindhouse faves. If you're too young for that, what have you discovered on DVD and Home Video... or at special screenings that you may have attended.

This should be taken as a forum of discovery and celebration for a beloved film geek period between the sixties and the early eighties. Now - let's kick this fucker off with Annette Kellerman, whom I met as a young, hot college gal that was grinding it out to her own particular love of the Grindhouse... Oh yes, Girls do love these films! You better fucking believe it!

Hey Harry-here's my two cents.

Growing up in small town Oklahoma didn't give me much exposure to Grindhouse cinema. My experience with the genre began when I met Tom Joad my freshman year of college. Each week he warped my mind with a new batch of ridiculously bad quality VHS tapes he received in the mail from the various magazines and catalogs he tirelessly searched for new and crazy titles. I had no idea at the time that I was receiving the best cinematic education of my life! By the time we met Harry at the all-night exploitation marathon at QT 2, I was already completely hooked and have been ever since.

I wouldn't say this is my TOP ten (I hate picking favorites), but merely a sampling of some of the best I've seen so far. Where to begin...

1-THE MUTHERS, of course! I have a soft spot for women in prison movies and this blaxploitation/WIP/pirate (I shit you not) masterpiece is a crowd pleaser every time. Fuck Serena!

2-TORSO. The original "Don't"-the trailer has the announcer saying "Torso!" over and over. The film itself is solid Italian gore. "Torso! Torso!"

3-FIGHT FOR YOU LIFE. Absolutely the most kickass home invasion flick I've ever seen with a great twist on racial stereotypes. Deadwood fans will love the disturbed performance from a very young William Sanderson.

4-GHETTO FREAKS. I saw this with Tom Joad the night we met Harry at QT 2, and I've never been the same since. This film gets my "so bad its great" award. A totally weird pseudo social message film with fantastic trips scenes.

5-ABBY. I have many fond memories of watching this blaxploitation version of The Exorcist in Harry's backyard with the crew. Yes, Harry actually owns a print of this gem.

6-THE BIG DOLL HOUSE. Another women-in-prison classic, this flick brings together one of my favorite trios-Pam Grier, Sid Haig, and the brilliant director Jack Hill. Fans of Jackie Brown will notice the familiar "99 Years" sung by Grier herself.

7-BROTHERHOOD OF DEATH. Not just another blaxploitation flick, this film takes us on a journey to Vietnam and then back to the deep south where a trio of hometown boys (NFL stars) seek revenge on the local Klan.

8-GATES OF HELL. I am a Fulci fan. I am also a fan of watching a girl literally puke up her guts (intestines and all) and a guy getting his brains drilled out. Terrific splatter gold.

9-PRETTY MAIDS ALL IN A ROW. I had to throw a cheerleader movie in here somewhere and what better testosterone fest than one starring Rock Hudson as the mack daddy of them all? Throw in murder, plenty of T and A, and Angie Dickinson and I'm in every time.

10-ROLLING THUNDER. A classic revenge tale starring William Devane and a fresh faced Tommy Lee Jones. I absolutely swoon every time I see Tommy hand William the shot gun as he says, "Let's go get 'em" in his most serious deadpan.

There are so many more I'd love to name, but I guess 10 is a good limit!

Cheers,

Annette Kellerman



Next is Capone - up there in Chicago - he's our man on the scene. He's a bit out of his territory, but he's put together a pretty fun list. Here ya go...

Hey everyone. Capone in Chicago here. Although I'm the the underworld kingpin of Chicago today, I actually grew up in a Maryland, in an immediate suburb of Washington, D.C., so I had a fair amount of access to three very important outlets where grindhouse cinema: a college campus (specifically the University of Maryland, which had a student-run movie theater at the time that played some fucked-up stuff); drive-ins in Maryland; and a few choice run-down movie houses in D.C., specifically Georgetown (the long-dead Key Theatre springs to mind). These places wouldn't know a first-run movie if it bit them in the poop-hole, and thank God for that.

I don't pretend to be any kind of expert on the history of grindhouse, and I'm not even sure if all of my picks qualify as classic grindhouse cinema. But each in their own special way, these are the films that messed me up, opened my eyes, and/or introduced me to a kind of filmmaking and theater-going experience that the local six-screen multiplex near my house just couldn't give me. These are by no means the best films I could think of. They are more the ones that just took me years to shake, with little success. Some of these are entry-level grindhouse choices, your basic 101 stuff, but there are a couple of selections I'm guessing nobody else is going have. I'm not trying to impress anybody with my vast knowledge of obscure cinema; I just want to give you a little gruel for thought. In no particular order...

MANIAC (1980) -- A slasher film (complete with nice Tom Savini gore effects) that isn't just a slasher film. It includes a competent and frustrating love story, a simple psychological profile, and a gritty atmosphere. This is that rare sick freak who actually makes us believe he's interested in bettering his life. Then the blood starts a-flowin'...

ALICE IN WONDERLAND (1976) -- The only musical-comedy on the list. If you don't see the X-rated version, well you're not really missing that much. Never miss an opportunity to have one of your favorite children's stories turned into a fuck fest, complete with some of the hairiest...um, rabbits...I've ever seen.

ILSA, SHE WOLF OF THE SS (1975) -- Is there any taboo this film didn't shatter? Nazi's fucking, torturing, raping. A dinner scene that defies good taste. A harrowing murder by melting ice block. Boiling flesh, pain experiments. I'm not exactly scoring points for originality here, but there's a reason this film turns up on some many lists like this.

SLAUGHTER OF THE VAMPIRES (1962) -- I obsessed over vampire movies for most of my life. Christopher Lee will always be my favorite Dracula, but Dieter Eppler ("the Italian Christopher Lee") in this DRACULA ripoff directed by Roberto Mauri, injects a whole lot of ferocity and seductiveness into his performance. I was reminded of this film because it just came out on DVD this year, and I strongly recommend checking it out if only for the stunning women on display here.

DARK HABITS (1983) -- Put simply, this is the film that introduced me to the twisted mind of Pedro Almodovar. If the only films by the Spanish master that you're familiar with are his more mature, colorful, spiritually uplifting works, you don't know what you're missing. Nuns on drugs, nuns writing sexually explicit novels, nuns acting like maniacs. There was a time when Almodovar's overt attacks on the church were the stuff of legend. Before he was a director who wrote Oscar-worthy roles for women, he was an angry gay man who frequently cast the exquisite Carmen Maura as his voice piece. In other films of this era, he showed us gay and straight sex as a weapon and was as compelling as he is today but in far less subtle ways. But DARK HABITS is a great jumping-off point for his early, passionate era.

THE STREET FIGHTER (1974) -- First time I ever saw Sonny Chiba. 'Nuff said.

SHOCK CORRIDOR (1963) -- Sam Fuller's masterpiece about a journalist who strives for authenticity and answers, and commits himself into an insane asylum to solve a murder. A film as insane and out of control as the characters in it. So many great performances and a few of them seem a little to real.

CANNIBAL HOLOCAUST (1980) -- What can I say about this? Again, I'm not bowling you over with originality, but tell me you don't remember the first time you saw this. As much as the simulated rape and hideous killings bothered me when I first saw this film, it was the very real animal killings that really shook me up and stayed with me.

DISCO FEVER (1978) -- A year after SATURDAY NIGHT FEVER, this piece of shit dance movie came out that has next to nothing to do with disco, although you may feel slightly feverish after watching it (which may be impossible, since it's not available on VHS or DVD). All I remember about this movie is that Casey Kasem is in it, and it's about a club owner who arranges for a former teen idol's comeback as part of some ridiculous revenge scheme. The music is forgettable; what little dancing their is looks like it was choreographed by a muppet. So why am I putting this movie on my list if it sucks so bad? Because so much grindhouse is shit, and this was the king of the shithouse in my mind.

MULTIPLE MANIACS (1970) -- Growing up so close to Baltimore, it's not surprising that I was exposed to John Waters and Divine at an early age. Although he would never remember it, Waters was the first filmmaker I ever met, during a retrospective of his work in D.C. When I went to shake his hand, the look in his eye told me "Who let this kid into my movie?" But he was so nice and funny, and his films were the first ones that set me on a path toward loving and appreciating perversity in its purist form. Lady Divine and her group of wacky kidnappers were my heroes. But what about this film sends it into the stratosphere of my world? Two words: Lobster Rape.

Capone
Got A Grind You Want To Give Me?




Next we have a short and sweet list from Lars Nilsen! Who? Well, Lars is the brilliant demented mind behind the Alamo Drafthouse's WEIRD WEDNESDAY onslaught of grindhouse titles. Lars is responsible for the further cinema education of the Austin area. The free screenings that he hosts every Wednesday night at Midnight at the Alamo are dedicated 100% to the greater glory of cool obscure weird fucking movies that you come away thanking God, Lars and The Alamo Drafthouse for showing you. Here's his list:
Harry,

I particularly love:

THE CANDY SNATCHERS - Pretty much perfect - harsh seventies bringdown.

TRUCK TURNER - Best dialogue. See it with a crowd!

SCREAM BABY SCREAM - hard to choose a Joseph Adler movie but this one rocks
the groovy horror angle.

TWILIGHT PEOPLE - The ambience, the music, a perfect summer night movie.

DARKER THAN AMBER - Before Robert Clouse became typecast as the "assault on
the impregnable fortress" director.

HELLS ANGELS ON WHEELS - the best biker movie ever.

VENUS IN FURS - the Jess Franco one, super Euro cool.

MR. SCARFACE - not DiLeo's tippity-top best (CALIBRE 9, MANHUNT, THE BOSS)
but it's such a cool plot.

BLACK COBRA - My favorite Laura Gemser/Joe D'Amato collaboration - magical.

THE NUDE VAMPIRE - The ultimate Jean Rollin serial homage.

It will be different tomorrow but that's where I'm at right now.

Best,

Lars




Who can follow Lars? The Boss o' Lars... that's right Tim League himself. He took a little bit of time out of his amazingly busy schedule building the ALAMO DRAFTHOUSE At The Ritz and Attending the Brussels genre film festival searching for the latest and greatest for FANTASTIC FEST this September. As the owner and operator of perhaps the last great Grindhouse theater of them all... that's still kicking it, long after the craze had alleged died to the morality and financial realities thrust upon it by Ronald Reagan. Here's Tim League...
I'm going to give you a list of some of my all-time favorite Weird Wednesday titles. That series has been my Grindhouse experience for the past 6 years.

10) Emma Mae (Black Sister's Revenge)

9) Darktown Strutters

Night Warning

7) Abar the 1st Black superman

6) Bonnie's Kids

5) Devil Times Five

4)Toys are not for Children

3) Poor Pretty Eddie

2) Snakes

1) Candy Snatchers



Now we have Quint's look at the world of GRINDHOUSE films. He was too young for the first go around, but thanks to the Drafthouse, Tarantino, Me and Home Video - Quint knows what he's talking about. Here ya go...
Ahoy, squirts! Quint here with my list of 10 Grindhouse movies that would be essential viewing if I was King of the World.

My thought was to try to pick a favorite from all different genres. Kung Fu, Italian Horror, Spaghetti Western, American Horror, Blaxploitation, Sexploitation, etc. In no particular order...

BLACK BELT JONES

This would be one of the more mainstream features, with Jim Kelly at his charismatic best. It's smart, funny, a bit gritty and rough, but it flies. "The son of a bitch threw his panties in my face!" "I want a piece of that cookie." "My cookie would kill you." Gloria Hendry was one hot mama, Jim Kelly was the shit and Scatman Crothers was the coolest cat in town. Absolute classic, with one of the best soundtracks ever.

CANNIBAL HOLOCAUST

Ruggero Deadato's infamous flick. It was banned damned near everywhere, with some of the most incredible and grotesque gore ever. Largely shot documentary fashion (BLAIR WITCH PROJECT was accused of ripping of its concept) about a group of youngsters making a documentary on primitive tribes in the Amazon. They run into some cannibals and you get genital mutilation, a girl hooked through her tits and strung up, plenty of real life footage of animal killing and the tip of the top... a skewered human being, stuck going up the butt, pointy end coming out of the mouth. You'd never see this one in multiplex that didn't have both Alamo and Drafthouse on the ticket stub.

SLEEPAWAY CAMP

This one might have come out a little after the Grindhouse trend ended, or at least when it was tapering off, but it's certainly a movie that was made for that experience. On the surface it's a FRIDAY THE 13TH rip-off, set at a summer camp. Lots of killer POV, ridiculous deaths, cartoonish and crazy characters (including more bo-hunks per scene than about any other film and an openly pedophile cook), kids cursing and the craziest fucking ending and twist of any film of the type. It looks like it was made for $2,79, cast almost completely with non-actors and is one of my favorite movies.

36TH CHAMBER OF SHAOLIN

Gordon Liu's classic. There had to be one period Kung Fu flick here, set in ancient China that has the classic Kung Fu hero's journey. Young man gets beat the fuck up. Young man undergoes a long and intense training to become a super badass. Young man gets revenge. A Shaw Brothers masterpiece.

THE BLACK SIX/BROTHERHOOD OF DEATH

I'm cheating here. These are two different movies, but I'm going to give them the same spot. I saw THE BLACK SIX at the Alamo at one of the Weird Wednesdays years ago and I saw BROTHERHOOD OF DEATH at an early Tarantino Film Fest.

THE BLACK SIX is a revenge story about a bunch of insane white bikers who see a black high school student dating a white girl, so, naturally, they kill him. Bad news for him is that the kid's brother is a member of an all-black Biker gang, composed of football players turned actors, including Mean Joe Green. This flick flies, combining three great Grindhouse genres... the revenge flick, the biker flick and the blaxploitation movie.

BROTHERHOOD OF DEATH follows a group of friends who return from a tour of Vietnam to find that KKK has taken over their town. Both are amazingly entertaining films, with non-actors depending on just their own charisma to keep the movie going.

THE BIG BIRD CAGE

No Grindhouse list is complete without a Jack Hill movie. There are many I could have chosen... Like THE SWINGING CHEERLEADERS or SWITCHBLADE SISTERS or COFFY or THE BIG DOLL HOUSE.

I'll go with THE BIG BIRD CAGE, though. It's about a slave camp where women are forced to process sugar in a giant wooden contraption. Pam Grier and Sid Haig are mercenaries who essentially orchestrate a big break out. Lots of sex, nudity, violence and sweat.

DJANGO

This might be a bit of an odd pick. Maybe it's right on the money, I'm not sure, but I know that I love it and it's not a big studio flick. This 1966 Spaghetti Western from Sergio Corbucci kicked my ass. Franco Nero stars as a gunslinger that drags a coffin behind him everywhere he goes. He lets no one touch it. He's that great Spaghetti Western type, the anti-hero who outwardly doesn't give a good goddamn about anybody, but stands up for the abused and kicks the evil bastards' asses. Robert Rodriguez said he stole the concept of weapons in a guitarcase for his Mariachi from this movie.

CITY OF THE LIVING DEAD

This is my favorite Lucio Fulci movie. He gets a lot of love for THE BEYOND, which I also really like, but CITY OF THE LIVING DEAD is all over the fucking place. It's fucking crazy. You have a girl crying blood before the evil ghost of a priest who committed suicide forces her to puke up all her organs just by staring at her. Some of the most outrageous gore, crazy sound effects (there are literally jungle sounds in a cityscape) and creepy-ass living dead ever.

DIRTY MARY, CRAZY LARRY

This is another one of my favorite movies. It's the car-chase entry to the list. You got Susan George... hot hot hot Susan George... and Peter Fonda on a carefree, reckless run from the law, represented by Vic Morrow (who does have a creepy-in-hindsight scene in a helicopter). Fonda is at his charismatic best and Susan George... well, like I said above... she's hot. The writing's surprisingly strong and the ending is bliss.

THE SIX-THOUSAND DOLLAR NIGGER

Is this movie a trip... This is another Alamo Weird Wednesday film. I've seen it projected twice now. The producers, probably wisely, changed the title to the safer SUPER SOUL BROTHER for video, but this is how it was released. It's a vehicle for Wildman Steve, a small comedy sensation, a sort of poor man's Rudy Ray Moore, about a drunk hobo who is pulled off the streets by a midget doctor and his evil financers to test a serum that'll turn a person into a sort of superman. The catch is that after 7 days the person dies. Wildman Steve is the bum and he is so amazingly on in this movie. This could be one of the best Weird Wednesdays ever run. It's hilarious, incredibly dated, so poorly made... but there's Wildman Steve and a midget doctor! It really is an undiscovered classic. It's like if Ed Wood made a blaxploitation movie at the height of his talent and enthusiasm.

There's my list. Hope there weren't too many repeats in there. I love all the above movies and if you have any inclination towards exploitation fare at all, do try to give all of them a watch, if you can find them. You might not like every single one as much as I do, but I guarantee each one offers up something different.

-Quint
Quint








Ok - stay tuned throughout today for updates from Moriarty, Tom Joad, Father Geek, Myself and many more. AND - if you feel you have the geek grindhouse cred to submit your own list to me... drop it to HK@AintItCool.Com with the Headline - "I Got Ground At The Grindhouse!" and I might include it here with the others. Stay tuned for more!

Odgledao sam podnosljivi skriner i evo par utisaka:

Ocekivao sam da budem oduvan i to se nije desilo.

Stvar izvlaci Eli Roth sa jedinim uspelim trejlerom, koji funkcionise kao kratki vic ili celina. Ostali trejleri mi jednostavno nisu bili dovoljno efektni.

Rodrigezova epizoda je vizeuelno dinamicna i ima par simpaticnih krvoprolica. Samo par, nista epohalno. U dramaturskom smislu ne drzi i ne udara u centar. Cak ni u akcionim scenama. Zamislite los nastavak Duhova sa Marsa.

Tarantinova epizoda ima sjajno uradjen prikaz ceonog sudara iz tri puta u kome gine cela prva postavka riba. Iako se dosta prica, pitko i simpaticno, nije me to nesto mnogo odusevilo. Sve je Ok ali nije nista specijalno.

Počeo sam da gledam GRINDHOUSE.

Prvo ću se osvrnuti na trejlere.

Trejleri su najbolji deo ovog filma. Teško ih je rangirati pošto su svi odlični.

THANKSGIVING - genijalan trejler ali gde je ovakav Eli Roth kada treba da se radi celovečernji film?

DON'T - savršeno skinut šmek dubbovanog Giallo filma sa hammer atmosferom. Wright sjajno koristi glas spikera i odlično stvara atmosferu dabovanog filma koji zato nema dijaloge u trejleru a sa svojim senzacionalističkim kadriranjem i rezovima stvara pravu bavijansku atmosferu. Voleo bih da gledam ovaj film.

WEREWOLF WOMEN OF THE SS - najpotcenjeniji trejler od svih. Meni je fenomenalno legao zato što odlično simulira tu kabaretsku, dekadentnu atmosferu serioznih scena u ovakvim filmovima koje uvek u sred totalnog exploitationa imaju te dodire snažnog pijeteta. Vrlo je autentično skinuo atmosferu tako da mi se čini da ovaj film ne bi gledao pošto znmam, kako to izgleda kad traje stotinak minuta.  Trejler malo kvari anarhičan twist ending.

MACHETE - izuzetno zanimljiv trejler, odlično skinuta atmosfera iako Rodriguez u nekoliko situacija citira štošta što smo već videli u DESPERADOu. zanimljivo je da stvarni film SHOOTER Antoine Fuque sada ide u bioskopima i ima isti plot kao MACHETE.

PLANET TERROR - Ovaj Rodriguezov film me je najviše podsetio na jedan film koji niko od nas do sada nije gledao, pa ni Rodriguez, ali se nadam da ćemo ga svi gledati, a to je pančevački zombi horor ZONA MRTVIH.

No osnovu Todorovićevog i Konjevićevog scenarija, a sada i na osnovu Rodriguezovog filma, vidim kakve posledice može ostaviti nekontrolisano gledanje Cannon filmova.  

Mislim da bi ovaj film trebalo da bude jako dobra škola ekipi ZONE MRTVIH da izbegne neke od grešaka koje je napravio Rodriguez pošto u suštini pokušavaju da naprave istu stvar.

Mislim da će ekipa ZONE biti oduševljena kada bude videla koliko Rodriguez misli na njihovoj frekvenciji, ne samo u filmu već i u trejleru za MACHETE. I PLANET TERROR zaista može biti jako dobra lekcija, i tu se uopšte ne šalim.

Prvo ni sam Rodriguez, iako živi u zemlji u kojoj su svi filmski kanoni izmišljeni, ima malo problem da nam proda određene segmente svoje stilizacije. Naime, njegov film se dešava sada, ove godine, a on povremeno, spontano kliza nazad u sedamdesete i osamdesete i ne samo da stilski evocira te filmove već ih evocira i po sadržaju, ui po izvesnim elementima dizajna. Otud, na nivou dizajna Rodriguez jako meandrira između nečega što je savremeni film i nečega što je izvorni grindhouse i paradoksalno najbliži je izvornom grindhouseu onda kada i snima predele, ljude i automobile koji liče na to vreme.

Isto tako u odnosima među likovima, Rodriguez ne uspeva da postavi jasnu liniju iz kog su oni filma. Tu ima i De Palme, i Carpentera i raznih nekih Cormanovih pravaca, i sve je to na svoj način grindhouse ali je jako nekoherentno. Za razliku od KILL BILLa gde su takođe pravljene posvete raznim žanrovima ali je to sve bilo savršeno spojivo u Tarantinovoj viziji.

Rodriguezov film se zbog nedostatka tog unutrašnjeg tkiva, i zajedničkog stilskog ključa pretvara u jednu papazjaniju raznih atrakcija, koje su spopradično genijalne, ali nisu emotivno pripremljene i samim tim nemaju adekvatnu težinu. Tome bih još dodao da su te atrakcije u retkim momentima elaboriranme, talo da senzacionalističke fotkr ili faze iz trejlera nisu mnogo produbljene u samom filmu, kako scenaristički, tako ni rediteljski. I to je šteta pošto je ovaj film, iako prepun ripper skevenci, akcije, gorea, suspense momenata u suštini dosadan, nerazvijen na makro i mikro planu, a u sebi na nivou samih scena ima odličnih ideja i rešenja za dva filma.

U svakom slučaju, PLANET TERROR je zanimljiva diverzija, koja se bavi atraktivnim stvarima, sa odličnim glumcima, na odličnim lokacijama, ali ne uspeva da dobaci ni do trećine zbira tih kvalitetnih elemenata.

Hmmmm... Aj odlgedaj i Tarantina pa da čujemo poređenje (BTW, kakav je kvalitet skrinera? pretpostavljam da gledaš sa skrinera, al ja nisam hteo da skidam pre nego što čujem umirujuće reči o dobrom kvalitetu). Po Internetu su kritike prilino raznolike, neke uzdižu Rodrigeza jer je 'zabavan' a pljuju Tarantina jer je 'dosadan', a neke obrnuto, kažu da je Rodrigez 'isprazan' a Tarantino 'jako pametan'.

...GRINDHOUSE, koji sam ja dobavio i koji je jedini dobacio do Srbijice, je bash, bash pristojan screener, ton je pristojno razaznatljiv a slika savrsheno mirije( da budem precizniji, radi se o snimku standardnog, 3/5 brojchano gledano, tele-sync kvaliteta)...

Quote from: "ginger toxiqo 2 gafotas"...GRINDHOUSE, koji sam ja dobavio i koji je jedini dobacio do Srbijice, je bash, bash pristojan screener, ton je pristojno razaznatljiv a slika savrsheno mirije( da budem precizniji, radi se o snimku standardnog, 3/5 brojchano gledano, tele-sync kvaliteta)...

Hm, hm, dobro, videćemo da li 'ton je pristojno razaznatljiv' važi i za nas nagluve.

načitao sam se kritika za grajnd kor, i sve mi se čini da je recepcija filma u kritičarskim krugovima veoma ambivalentna, nesigurna i neodređena. toliko opštih mesta i papagajskog ponavljanja skoro nisam čuo. te "tarantino je i dalje u svom stilu", te "njegovi briljantni dijalozi", te "rodrigez je napravio treš film, tako da mu ne možete zameriti što je treš", sve do njujorkerove kritike sasvim zbunjenog tipa koja veli da u grajndhauzu ima previše sečenja i komadanja ljudskog tela, što u današnje doba nije nimalo zabavno.
pomalo je smešno da amerikanci ne umeju da prepoznaju reinterpretiranje svog sopstvenog pop-kulturnog nasleđa, i smešno je što ovaj film tumače jedino kao, eto, gotivan pokušaj dvojice kul tipova da naprave film nostalgije za svojom mladošću.
kao da je ono što film pokušava da kaže i na čemu se bazira u totalnom nesporazumu sa recepcijom na koju nailazi kod kritike.
što je zanimljivo za nas, koji se oduševljavamo ko kučići tim istim stvarima kao i tarantino i rodrigez, a većina američkih kritičara to posmatra čak ne ni sa prezrenjem, već sa totalnim nerazumevanjem i nemarom.
ali ne treba se čuditi. ipak su francuzi, a ne ameri, stvorili film noir i protumačili ga ao kritiku američkog društva, i opet su francuzi rekli za rodžera kormana, "His films are a desperate cry from the heart of a grotesque fast food culture." jedino što to stoji na verziji scenarija za true romance, tako da je tarantino svestan kakvu virtualnu viziju evropljani gaje o američkoj pop kulturi, i treba razmisliti kako i zašto radi to što radi.
po meni je, opet, nemoguće pravilno tumačiti death proof, pa ni planet terror, a nemati u vidu recentnu filmsku teoriju. death proof je napadno svestan feminističke teorije i teorije aparatusa. rekao bih u stvari da je grindhouse, osim evociranja uspomena na istinsko bioskopsko iskustvo, double feature tela i teorije, i izgleda da je, nažalost, napravljen pomalo iza horizonta kritičarskih očekivanja.

Hm, moram da priznam, Žiko, da teorija može bti jedno a praksa drugo. GH još nisam odgledao, ali ako je Kil Bil ikakav indikator, sva živa konceptualizacija, surovo referenciranje i post-postmodernistički citati mogu funkcionisati na intelektualnom planu, a da te film estetski ipak ostavi hladnim ili čak pomalo iznerviranim.

Uzgred, nisam siguran da se 'mi ovde oduševljavamo ko kučići za tim stvarima' pošto su, barem meni i Sin Siti i Kil Bil bili primeri možda smelosti u poslovnom ali ne i u umetničkom smislu i, naprosto, nisu mi previše prijali...

Takođe, voleo bih iz svoje pozicije neznalice da čujem detaljnije o tome kako su francuzi izmislili film noir, s obzirom da ja živim u u ubeđenju da je njihov černi talas došao dobru deceniju i kusur kasnije od američkog. Ovde ne dovodim u pitanje tvoje tačne opservacije na odnos francuskog noira prema Americi, samo se pitam da li su Hjustonovi filmovi iz četrdesetih i pedesetih noir or what?

Quote from: "Meho Krljic"Takođe, voleo bih iz svoje pozicije neznalice da čujem detaljnije o tome kako su francuzi izmislili film noir, s obzirom da ja živim u u ubeđenju da je njihov černi talas došao dobru deceniju i kusur kasnije od američkog. Ovde ne dovodim u pitanje tvoje tačne opservacije na odnos francuskog noira prema Americi, samo se pitam da li su Hjustonovi filmovi iz četrdesetih i pedesetih noir or what?

oduševljavamo ko kučići se odnosilo na B filmove, ne na kill bill i sin city, u pogledu kojih se lično slažem, da prostiš, s tebe.
što se film noira tiče, o tome može kunac da ti kaže mnogo bolje od mene. film noir kao pravac i žanr nije postojao u americi, koliko je meni poznato, već su taj termin izmislila dvojica francuza, Nino Frank u levičarskom "L'ecran français" i Žan Pjer Kartije (Jean Pierre Chartier) u nešto konzervativnijem "Revue du cinema" . sa njima, i, nešto kasnije, sa knjigom Raymonda Bordea i Etiennea Chaumetona "Panorama du film noir americain" (1955), kamenom-međašem teorije o "film noiru", u stvari se i rađa taj termin.
i kad vidiš kako su ova potonja dvojica okupili sve te filmove pod noir kišobran, i kako su ih tumačili - dolazimo do te evropejske vizije američkog B filma, koja se nikad nije sasvim primila u samoj americi.

Hm, okej.

a evo i još detaljnije:

Zaključak Džejmsa Narimora u knjizi More Than Night: Film Noir in It's Context je da, kod Bordea i Chaumetona, noir nije "opisni termin", već
"name for a critical tendency within the popular cinema – an antigenre that reveals the dark side of savage capitalism. For Borde and Chaumeton, the essence of noirness lies in a feeling of discontinuity, an intermingling of social realism and oneiricism, an anarcho-leftist critique of bourgeois ideology, and an eroticized treatment of violence" .

a kad pitaju roberta mičama, on kaže - ma kakav onirizam i socijalna kritika, to je bilo tako mračno zato što smo imali samo dva reflektora.

pošto se sve bojim da u ovo doba noći nisam sasvim jasan, oću reći da su ameri 40ih i 50ih pravili neke krimiće, a onda su francuzi sve te raznorodne filmove okupili pod terminom film noir, po nekim konstruisanim (ovo ne kažem u negativnom smislu), teorijskim kriterijumima. otprilike se vidi po kojim iz navedenog citata.
to šta je kasnije u praksi francuski film noir je nešto drugo...

Mičam uspostavlja toliko potrebni balans...

Anyway, hoću da kažem da sasvim prihvatam ideju da je termin a za njim i ideološko/ estetsku definiciju žanra izmislio Francuz, i da su oni zatim retroaktivno lepljeni na odgovarajuće filmove. Što nije u suprotnosti sa činjenico, da su takve filmove Ameri radili još od kraja četrdesetih.

Edit: dok ja ovo otkucah, Žile reče istu stvar lepšim rečima.

...just right! Francuzi su samo teorijski uobličili ono što su Amerikanci u praksi već radili, mada su neki od njih, Dassin i Clouzot, dosta dobrog doprineli široj noir priči...

...o tome, nartavno, mnogo više i mudrije od svih prisutnih može kucnuti profesor/doktor Kunac...

*** John Huston možda i nije baš najzgodniji za ogled jer je, zahvaljujuci svojoj veštini, geniji i malo sreći, uspeo da protegne svoju karijeru kroz nekoliko decenija i gotovo sve žanrove/ stilove...whatever i stvori sjajna dela, mada THE MALTESE FALCON, KEY LARGO, THE ASPHALT JUNGLE i BEAT THE DEVIL nesporno spadaju u sam vrh ne samo njegovog opusa nego i uopšte

Quote from: "ginger toxiqo 2 gafotas"...just right! Francuzi su samo teorijski uobličili ono što su Amerikanci u praksi već radili, mada su neki od njih, Dassin i Clouzot, dosta dobrog doprineli široj noir priči...

...o tome, nartavno, mnogo više i mudrije od svih prisutnih može kucnuti profesor/doktor Kunac...

*** John Huston možda i nije baš najzgodniji za ogled jer je, zahvaljujuci svojoj veštini, geniji i malo sreći, uspeo da protegne svoju karijeru kroz nekoliko decenija i gotovo sve žanrove/ stilove...whatever i stvori sjajna dela, mada THE MALTESE FALCON, KEY LARGO, THE ASPHALT JUNGLE i BEAT THE DEVIL nesporno spadaju u sam vrh ne samo njegovog opusa nego i uopšte

Da, meni su baš na umu bili Maltese Falcon i Asphalt Jungle kao filmovi koje sam još kao dječarac upamtio kao definiciju noir žanra u američkom fimu.

Mene ja PLANET TERROR toliko iznurio da zaista nisam imao snage da se odmah upustim u Tarantina, a još imajući u vidu da sam pouzdano čuo da je nepodnošljivo dosadan nisam imao snage ni da ga načnem. No, pogledaću.

Samo opušteno, mada, navikli smo da ti prvi golim grudima jurišaš na bajonete, da mi ne bismo morali pa onda to očekujemo u svakom novom slučaju.

Da smo partizani ja bih uvek bio onaj koji ostaje ranjen u šumi i traži da mu ostavite bombi da uspori okupatore koji su u poteri.

Uvek me ostavljate sa suzama u očima, mada vam je nekako i drago što ste se rešili debelog i što ima ko da ostane.